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Help me with your suggestions of Wine Stars of Tomorrow


How was the Camel Valley sparkling?


Disappointing. All yeast, no fruit, and nothing much left once the fizz went.


Shame! Sounds like a disappointing tasting.


Not really: interesting to try some wines I wouldn’t have thought of buying, for example the Navarre and the Chinese, and to get a sample of the Undarraga.


Beaujolais - surely its time it had it’s day!

Absolutely unique - and superb as a lighter ‘food’ wine. As yet, Gamay is unsuccessful when grown anywhere else in the world (unlike the ubiquitous Chardonnay & Cabernets etc). The real gem is it doesn’t age well beyond 8 ish years at best, so there is no risk of it becoming an overpriced investment commodity.

But if I really must stick to the thread… then Canadian wines will come to the fore over the next few decades as Global Warming pushes viable vineyards further north (and regretfully California becomes desert)


I think its fair to say that Sheila was very much in the minority. As always there were varying views, and most wines were the favourite of some members. Several members told me that they liked all the wines.

I was a bit surprised that one guest told me the Chenin was the best he’d ever tasted and he was going to buy some.

The TWS Exhibition GV showed very well and was a favourite of several members. The Chinese Cabernet Gernischt surprised, many giving the back handed compliment that it was better than they expected.

I found the TWS Blind Spot Tempranillo had a distinct eucalyptus taste that I didn’t notice when I originally drank the wine.

Its not true that these wines were inevitably young with vintages going back to 2013 and old vines 30-69+ years being usedon several, or made by inexperienced winemakers.

But events like this are an opportunity to taste wines that one maybe wouldn’t buy.

I didn’t think the Camel Valley fizz showed well last night, it was a small pour in an ISO glass and I wonder how clean they were for the first wine as my glass didn’t have many bubbles. I’d had this wine before and it was delicious enough to buy extra bottles for my own use.

(I’d previously bought and drunk all the wines -except for this vintage of the Chinese wine- to chose the wines for the tasting0


Good to hear there were differing opinions and people liked different wines. That’ll teach me to reach a conclusion on the basis of one opinion!
And, as @SPmember said - these events often offer a chance to try wines one would have not necessarily chosen, and be pleasantly surprised in the process. :+1:


Oh - that overlooks quite a lot of gamay grown along the length of the Loire, both on its own and blended with pinot noir. More to my taste in general, though that’s probably because I don’t get on with carbonic maceration wines too well. The blend of gamay with pinot is also traditional in Burgundy as Bourgogne Passetoutgrains. The blends do age quite gracefully, as do the (mostly) non-carbonic wines from Beaujolais, such as Jadot’s Chateau des Jacques wines.

On the Camel Valley fizz, it doesn’t sound quite right. Whilst it isn’t the most complex English sparkler and would normally get outclassed by such as Hambledon and Nyetimber on that front, it does generally do a good job of being a crowd-pleaser and that’s no bad thing. Maybe some low-level cork taint?


Ah, it seems that between myself & the Ghost we cover Gamay’s output. It’s interesting that the last bottle of high end Jadot Beaujolais I tasted (I think it was a Moulin-a-vent from TWS) - was far too much a Burgundy lookalike, so not really what I wanted with my steak frites.

Certainly the Loire Gamay blends have merit, but in all honesty I have not yet found one on a par with a decent Morgon. Which is good - at least some of the Beaujolais growers make a living!


Really enjoyed hearing about this @peterm - what an interesting selection! :smiley: The Chinese wine isn’t one I’d have considered buying (I’ve only ever tried disappointing examples) but I might grab a bottle!

How was the natural wine?


The concept was what we’ll be drinking in the 2020s… I think its certain that Chinese wines will be on the shelves. I remember a time when there were no USA wines, no Australian and no NZ wines in supermarkets, now you can find them everywhere.

The wines I picked were examples either of the variety or region (China) or type (English Sparkling) rather than a proposal that this was the actual wine we would be drinking.

I’ve had Tempranillo in British Columbia and Texas that were stunning – but they are not available here; the only non-Spanish one I found was TWS Blind Spot from Australia.

Only non Austrian Gruner I could find was Diemersdal from South Africa but I didn’t think that is as good an expression of the variety as the one I chose.

The natural wine was good, enjoyably fruity. I had kept it chilled since purchase as per the back label and served it chilled - as per back label. I won’t buy more s its too much of a faff.

I wonder if not keeping/serving cool my original choice, as suggested here, the TWS Radford Dale ‘Nudity’ Syrah, was the reason it was too foul to drink.


TWS served Te Mata Estate Gamay Woodthorpe Vineyard at a recent lunch and it was cracking. I bought it and enjoyed it at home

I agree there are some excellent wines being grown in Canada, but so far production is low and prices are high. We already see super ice wine (amazingly for £14.99 at Lidl last year) and I think TWS had a Canadian table wine a while ago.

Going back to your earlier point, I’ve had good Gamay in Ontario


I didn’t taste the bottle Sheila had, but no-one commented negatively at the time on any of the Camel Valley - we had four bottles of each wine.


There were 58 people at the tasting. Two of the guests that night enjoyed it so much they are joining the club. Unfortunately tho’ many (most?) members of the club are also TWS members , they do not yet participate in this forum



Not noticed this thread previously and I did laugh at myself!
Have only tasted a few of the wines in the original post, more than a couple of times.
I disliked most of them.
Currently, Prosecco too sweet for me, not a fan of Malbec - and believe me I’ve tried.
What is fashionable, very often comes and goes; thank the Lord!
A bit like each January’s new diet that is touted as revolutionary but most can hardly recall it’s name in March. Every year a new one, someone writes a book, makes some money, no one reads it and we move on.
With wine it is very much the same with few exceptions.
The Emperors New Clothes, but Cab Sauv & Franc, Merlot Pinot, Syrah, Grenache Chardonnay, Viognier and Sauv Blanc are the big sellers and will probably remain so. I might have forgotten a couple of varieties but the list endures.
If there was really another great variety or wine out there, we would probably heard of it.
Fashion, it comes and goes. It gets reinvented like flares or mini/maxi skirts but designers can only do so much with a hem length or a trouser width.
But commerce requires change in order to create interest and sales, so like the “revolutionary January Diet” we can expect to see new products with stories and labels to suit.
I, in a moment of true lunacy paid £75 for a pair of shoes that were high fashion, I wore them once!! Ted Heath was PM and I was going through my moron phase.
We all do it, no shame there, but I learnt my lesson.
So no Greek wine, tried it twice and hated it!!
No Austrian wine, not a fan of glycol.
Mussar tastes baked to me.
Riesling, especially old - burnt rubber.
Note to readers, no doubt being unfair but this is my personal experience. LOL!!
Mateus, Blue Nun, Hirondelle, Piat d’Or etc all spawned siblings and not one of them any good.

Apologies to those who like some of the above,
These days I think that my time, drinking allowance (health wise) and disposable financial “wealth lol1” should be spent enjoying what I adore. We all cannot like everything, taste or buy everything etc, so why even try.

I have found my wine heroes and as far as January, just eat less; it works for me!!


Not totally correct Taffy, the four most popular white grapes are Chardonnay Sauvignon Blanc, Pinot Grigio and Riesling whether you like it or not, the only grape of that group that could be called fashionable is PG, and Viognier has failed to become that popular despite years of being told it is the next big thing.
And reds ! Tempranillo is hardly a fashionable grape, but may well be the most produced, Malbec despite your distaste is huge now and came from France in the first place and is not going anywhere but up as the high level wineries come on stream.
It is not so much the grape variety that is the fashion but the way the grape is manipulated for a particular style and then promoted often by the wine press themselves and critics, ie over oaked Chardonnays, and far to many over gooseberried SBs or supercharged Syrahs, most of which fortunately have had their time, but that does not mean some other grape will be buggered up in the quest for fashion.
Other grapes can and do compete when well managed, my recent Damascene moment with Pinotage proves that :star_struck:


Ahhh! What a trip down memory lane! But there were worse - I vividly remember “Don Cortez Spanish Burgundy” - a sulphurous, tongue-rasping mess (red) or a sulphurous gut-wrencher (white). Best taken to other people’s parties (this is student days we are talking about - I certainly wouldn’t do that now).

But after all these years, I too have my “avoid” list. It’s not the same as yours, but so what? Vive la difference! And despite their popularity at the time, I doubt that anyone at the time regarded the wines listed above as Wine Stars in any way - maybe just the producers’ bean-counters.


A latecomer to this thread.

If a few recent experiences (mainly “down South”) are anything to go by the next big thing looks to be Argentinian Torrontes. It seems to be being taken up by the same circles who insisted previously on serving me copious amounts of ice cold, tasteless Pinot Grigio (known as Pinot Grungio in our house).

PG is a grape I just don’t get. However I’ve had a couple of promising experiences with Torrontes.

However this trend may be driven as much by economics as fashion or taste. The Peso has been dropping against the pound. https://www.exchangerates.org.uk/GBP-ARS-exchange-rate-history.html
If the Euro exchange rate worsens Argentinian wine could look ever better value.

I’ve had several amazing Argentinian wines this last year or so. Susanna Balbo Malbec is a firm favourite (I hope we’ll see the signature back on the WS list) but my biggest surprise was a Chardonnay we had with dinner at the Hand and Flowers. I was dubious, I admit it. However the sommelier convinced me to try it. Trapezio Plus ++ 2012. Stunning.

I think Chardonnay is ripe to come back in fashion and Argentina might just be well set to ride the crest on the basis of quality/price ratio…


I confess to not being overly fond of Malbec, but have consistently enjoyed the Catena wines. A small drop in price would be a bonus.


Taste is so personal and you are right to concentrate your drinking in the areas that give you the most pleasure! The more people who hate riesling the better as I don’t want to see a Burgundy like price hike on Mosel wines. :wink: